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Ukraine
#41
Well without wishing to sound gung-ho about it, yes, it really is so bad that someone needs to do something about it. Not as an all-guns-blazing, Western-led operation, but more realistically by disaffected Russian special forces.

The thing is, if nuclear conflict is avoided, this could lead to a horrible sort of stalemate, and an impoverished Russia could end up as a failed state. Which would be an even greater security risk, almost impossible to handle.

You really do hope that sooner or later the rouble crashes so far that the armed forces will mutiny because they have no food, and their pay is worthless.

And that is truly the only two ways I can see us getting out of this. Or maybe if the campaign lead to massive Russian casualties. Not that that would be any comfort to the Ukrainians, their losses might be even greater.

Reading about the war is grim. The Russians have obviously taken leave of their senses, being prepared to use cluster bombs against innocent civilians, shelling live nuclear power plants.

Admittedly if that caused a meltdown, that would have been horrific, but would perhaps have provided the sort of terminal shock and reality check the Russians need to back off and stop fighting.

In another alarming development, the British government is preparing to roll out emergency alerts. The sort that would make everyone’s phone ring and ring if activated. This would basically be like Protect and Survive and the four-minute warning. There was a plan to do something similar about 20 years ago, but that only involved landlines.

It is really, really not pleasant to read about developments like this, and World War Three being talked about in frank and open terms. No-one wants to be seven days from war. It just doesn’t bear thinking about.
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#42
It says the emergency alerts only work on 4G or 5G signals. I don’t know whats scarier, the idea of getting one or not getting one cause you’ve got a crap signal.
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#43
Isn’t it more to do with the technology your handset’s got?? Thousands of old folks only have crappy old prepaid Nokia’s “for emergencies”. You know the thing, they put £10 of credit on as a once-off, and get surprised when the SIM card gets disconnected because they don’t use it.

People like them would never receive alerts because they’re not using the latest systems versions, whether Android or iOS.

Just read now that if the power station attack had resulted in a meltdown and radiation release, and it drifted westwards, NATO countries would even regard that as an act of war. And call it World War Three.

That has to stop right now. There should be no military action called unless it involves the use of weapons.
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#44
I thought we'd all realised by now that all this alert and 4 minute warning stuff is nonsense anyway.

If the UK got nuked, you'd be far better off being vaporised in the first blast.
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#45
There could be an upside. The Germans had a nasty surprise when they found that some of the Soviet-era missiles they were sending to Ukraine had corroded. Seriously, they were that old, they didn’t work. Wow

If the Russian missiles are just as bad, there might be a nasty crater where Moscow used to be…
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#46
(05-03-2022, 12:49 AM)jumbler Wrote: The thing is, if nuclear conflict is avoided, this could lead to a horrible sort of stalemate, and an impoverished Russia could end up as a failed state. Which would be an even greater security risk, almost impossible to handle.

When the Soviet Union collapsed (much larger than today's Russia) it had effectively become a failed state (until the soon-to-be oligarchs stole everything).  Nothing bad happened outside of that sphere.  The economy of today's Russia is about the size of Italy's (not insignificant, but not earth shattering).

Meanwhile Putin has joined forces with Xi.  China's economy is much larger than Russia's and Xi will surely take advantage of that and make Putin his vassal (sort of like Putin and Trump).  Xi is that kind of guy.
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#47
Quote:If the UK got nuked, you'd be far better off being vaporised in the first blast.
.

I guess it's a good thing I live only 2.5 miles from the city center.
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#48
(05-03-2022, 01:35 AM)ladsnet Wrote: I thought we'd all realised by now that all this alert and 4 minute warning stuff is nonsense anyway.

If the UK got nuked, you'd be far better off being vaporised in the first blast.

I watched a video on YouTube yesterday that simulated all out nuclear war between Russia and NATO. Basically within 24 hours of non stop bombing c. 190 million people would be dead (roughly 10% of NATO population and 60% of the Russian population). After that would come several days of nuclear fallout in which many more would die from radiation poisoning as the nuclear dust cloud spread worldwide. Then came a prolonged period of nuclear winter in which little survives.

So yes, if this ever were to happen hope you go in the first 24 hours.
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#49
Well, this gave me a rare sense of pride in my country:

A surge of American veterans say they are now preparing to join the fight in Ukraine, emboldened by the invitation of the country’s president, Volodymyr Zelensky, who earlier this week announced he was creating an “international legion” and asked volunteers from around the world to help defend his nation against Russia.  Some of the veterans are highly skilled and hope to train Ukrainians in their expertise.

I believe that most American veterans tend to be right-wing Republican Second Amendment defenders.  But oh well, they do have a good bone in their bodies.
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#50
Quote:“international legion”

We know how well that went during the Spanish Civil War. Good on them, though.
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#51
(05-03-2022, 10:54 PM)Kev Wrote:
Quote:“international legion”

We know how well that went during the Spanish Civil War. Good on them, though.

If Zelensky sets them loose I suspect they'll give Putin a run for his money. Giddy
From what I read some of them are Iraq/Afghanistan hardened.  And think about it.  What kind of veteran wants to go back into the heat of battle?
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#52
Other than a coup in Russia I can't see an end to this now.

Putin won't admit defeat. The more difficult it is to win, the more he'll just flatten the country. Which will mean that the sanctions won't lift.. they'll just get worse and worse.. driving Russia into the dust.. and what will he do then ??

Its gone insane very quickly.
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#53
He's very dangerous now.  Not just for Ukraine, but for all of us.
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#54
If this passage from today’s Times is to be believed, it explains everything.
The Times Wrote:Spies in Russia’s infamous security apparatus were kept in the dark about President Putin’s plan to invade Ukraine, according to a whistleblower who described the war as a “total failure” that could be compared only to the collapse of Nazi Germany.

A report thought to be by an analyst in the FSB, the successor agency to the KGB, said that the Russian dead could already number 10,000. The Russian defence ministry has acknowledged the deaths of only 498 of its soldiers in Ukraine.

The report said the FSB was being blamed for the failure of the invasion but had been given no warning of it and was unprepared to deal with the effects of crippling sanctions.

The whistleblower added that no one in the government knew the true figure of the dead because “we have lost contact with major divisions”.
This is Putin’s war entirely, planned on a whim. That accounts for the lack of strategy and supplies. It’s all very well saying Russia has the world’s biggest army, with overwhelming force etc. etc., but if it cannot plan and execute a strategy (whether enough time was allowed or not), that suggests the campaign will fail.

The article continues.
The Times Wrote:The letter said that Ramzan Kadyrov, the Chechen leader and an ally of Putin, was on the verge of outright conflict with the Russians after his “hit squad”, sent to kill President Zelensky, was destroyed by Ukrainian forces.

Even if Zelensky were killed, the report said, Russia would have no hope of occupying Ukraine. “Even with minimum resistance from the Ukrainians we’d need over 500,000 people, not including supply and logistics workers.”

As many as 11,000 Russian soldiers have been killed in the fighting, according to the latest approximate figures published by the Ukrainian armed forces yesterday.

An estimated 44 aircraft, 285 tanks, 985 armoured vehicles, 109 artillery systems and 60 fuel tanks have also been destroyed.

When you add up those sorts of losses, the collapse of the rouble and the Russian economy and the logistics issues the Russians are facing, it becomes impossible for them to continue. Although the Russians can ship materiel by rail to the south of that country, or Belarus, they then have to transfer everything from wagons to trucks to enter Ukraine. Becoming a target for freedom fighters in the process.

Those losses and waste of lives/vehicles is going to hurt. And how are the Russians supposed to be able to afford to replace them?? Sooner or later they will be bankrupt, and completely spent (except for the nuclear weapons).
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#55
(07-03-2022, 01:44 AM)jumbler Wrote: Sooner or later they will be bankrupt, and completely spent (except for the nuclear weapons).

That reminds me of a worry I had in the early 80s, when their economic weakness was becoming clear to see, and they were "Upper Volta with rockets": that they'd think "we'd better use our nukes while we can still afford them".
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#56
1.5M refugees have now fled the country.

The UK has accepted 50 of them.

Global Britain - Leading the way Approve
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#57
(07-03-2022, 11:22 AM)ladsnet Wrote: 1.5M refugees have now fled the country.

The UK has accepted 50 of them.

Global Britain - Leading the way  Approve

50 is better than none.
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#58
I think my city has accepted more refugees than that.
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#59
(07-03-2022, 01:48 PM)RyCamp88 Wrote:
(07-03-2022, 11:22 AM)ladsnet Wrote: 1.5M refugees have now fled the country.

The UK has accepted 50 of them.

Global Britain - Leading the way  Approve

50 is better than none.

50 is pitiful.
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#60
(07-03-2022, 05:44 PM)Ollie2UK Wrote:
(07-03-2022, 01:48 PM)RyCamp88 Wrote:
(07-03-2022, 11:22 AM)ladsnet Wrote: 1.5M refugees have now fled the country.

The UK has accepted 50 of them.

Global Britain - Leading the way  Approve

50 is better than none.

50 is pitiful.

Why so few?  Is it a political issue where there is public opposition to admitting eastern Europeans?  Is it related to Brexit?
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