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England players booed
...for taking the knee
#1
Also happened at the Champions League final on Saturday too.

It's so hard to grasp what gets into people sometimes. I've seen comments online along the lines of "there's no room for politics in sport" as if these people think racism is a purely political issue.

If you're booing people for showing their opposition to racism then you're supporting...racism  Undecided

Gareth Southgate spoke well on the subject,

[+] 3 users Like Ollie2UK's post
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#2
Taking the knee is an empty gesture, what is it actually achieving, surely these footballers should take themselves into the steets and work with organisations to educate and tackle the problem. Folk go to football matches to watch football.
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#3
I'm with Ollie on this. It is a symbolic gesture but a gesture nonetheless. If you're against it then I don't know what you are.
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#4
Kev took part in a few protests for race issues in nyc before BLM was fashionable, I’m also not a fan of the pride days they have at football matches coz again they are just empty gestures, I stand by that we watch football for football, doesn’t make me a racist or homophobic. Like I said get out on the street and volunteer time and deal with things head on.
[+] 1 user Likes RyCamp88's post
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#5
Are political speeches by Academy Award recipients empty gestures too?  Should they be talking about the art of film instead of political issues at their acceptance speeches and "doing" something instead?
(BTW, I don't have an opinion yet on either case.  Still letting it settle in.  Just asking.)
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#6
Parsifal yes in part I think the speeches are empty gestures because away from the speech itself what is the person actually doing for the cause.
[+] 2 users Like RyCamp88's post
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#7
Do taking the knee and making a political acceptance speech have power to influence?
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#8
See, you can think these things are empty gestures, absolutely I can see this - but actively booing them? Sure, roll your eyes, mutter about "virtue signalling" if you must, but to boo - that's a negative response. It says I actively DISAGREE with the point you are making. So...I'm a racist.
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#9
(03-06-2021, 04:05 PM)Ollie2UK Wrote: It says I actively DISAGREE with the point you are making. So...I'm a racist.

I wouldn't go that far.  Maybe, as Ryan says, they're booing making a political statement at a football game.
(I don't know.  I wasn't there.)
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#10
(03-06-2021, 03:56 PM)Parsifal Wrote: Do taking the knee and making a political acceptance speech have power to influence?

Clearly not, as it’s still a problem.

(03-06-2021, 04:05 PM)Ollie2UK Wrote: See, you can think these things are empty gestures, absolutely I can see this - but actively booing them? Sure, roll your eyes, mutter about "virtue signalling" if you must, but to boo - that's a negative response. It says I actively DISAGREE with the point you are making. So...I'm a racist.

No they are booing coz they paid to watch football.
[+] 1 user Likes RyCamp88's post
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#11
(03-06-2021, 04:09 PM)RyCamp88 Wrote: No they are booing coz they paid to watch football.

Which is delayed by what - 10 seconds by the taking of the knee?

I don't believe for one minute they are booing because they want the football to start.
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#12
(03-06-2021, 04:17 PM)Ollie2UK Wrote:
(03-06-2021, 04:09 PM)RyCamp88 Wrote: No they are booing coz they paid to watch football.

Which is delayed by what - 10 seconds by the taking of the knee?

I don't believe for one minute they are booing because they want the football to start.

You have to ask yourself why did it take a high profile case in another countey for this to come about, surely if they felt so passionately about it all it should have happened long before, it’s the same as when companies jump on pride during pride month. They ha e to be seen to be doing something, it’s all very forced and has lost all impact at this point, people are bored of it and just want to watch a match and zone out from real world problems, it’s an escape. As I’ve said volunteer and educate if thy feel so strongly, but alas most haven’t. Which leads me to think so they really care about taking the knee.
[+] 1 user Likes RyCamp88's post
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#13
Indeed.

Can't see any other reason for booing it than you being a racist.

Baffled at people trying to justify or excuse it either.
[+] 5 users Like ladsnet's post
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#14
Whenever I click on a video and get a 5-second ad first I feel like booing. LOL
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#15
(03-06-2021, 01:06 PM)RyCamp88 Wrote: Taking the knee is an empty gesture, what is it actually achieving

Well, let’s see what it has achieved....  A few short years ago, a single man,  Colin Kaepernick, took the knee in protest against police brutality.  The following year, the racist president of the United States was braying loudly to fellow racists that players who protested like that should be fired.  Before the 4 year term of said racist president was over, taking the knee was already recognized worldwide - even in countries that do not see any American football - as a political protest against police brutality and against racial injustice.  The very public dialogue it started had the NFL players recognizing their power to stand up against racist billionaire owners, forcing the league commissioner to a public statement  that the NFL was on the wrong side of history and that Black Lives Matter.  Football stadia owned by billionaire owners were used in a bitterly contested election as polling places to make it easier to vote, pointedly against the strategy of the racist president and his Republican   party, of restricting voting opportunities.

Yeah, it’s sure empty and has achieved nothing.

You are wrong again.
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#16
Taking the knee has an image problem. While many players are doing it to promote respect and solidarity, taking the knee was also associated with the UK BLM (who I understand the US division has distanced itself from) manifesto being circulated online, that spoke to making the white man a slave and vengeance. Clearly some can't get past that, hence the boos.

The message is intended to be good, the method causes discourse. Perhaps they should try a different action or approach? While I have no doubt there will be card carrying racists among the people booing, it's assumption to label them all collectively as racists.

(03-06-2021, 04:40 PM)Parsifal Wrote: Whenever I click on a video and get a 5-second ad first I feel like booing. LOL

Adblock Plus if your friend!
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#17
We
(03-06-2021, 04:43 PM)jdcyl Wrote:
(03-06-2021, 01:06 PM)RyCamp88 Wrote: Taking the knee is an empty gesture, what is it actually achieving

Well, let’s see what it has achieved....  A few short years ago, a single man,  Colin Kaepernick, took the knee in protest against police brutality.  The following year, the racist president of the United States was braying loudly to fellow racists that players who protested like that should be fired.  Before the 4 year term of said racist president was over, taking the knee was already recognized worldwide - even in countries that do not see any American football - as a political protest against police brutality and against racial injustice.  The very public dialogue it started had the NFL players recognizing their power to stand up against racist billionaire owners, forcing the league commissioner to a public statement  that the NFL was on the wrong side of history and that Black Lives Matter.  Football stadia owned by billionaire owners were used in a bitterly contested election as polling places to make it easier to vote, pointedly against the strategy of the racist president and his Republican   party, of restricting voting opportunities.

Yeah, it’s sure empty and has achieved nothing.

You are wrong again.

We are talking about the uk.
[+] 1 user Likes RyCamp88's post
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#18
So, the political demonstrations around the globe for racial justice, and the particular form it takes in sports of ‘taking the knee’, are isolated within each country, huh? They’re not all tied together as a global movement, it’s just coincidence that they’re happening in different countries at this time in history?
[+] 2 users Like jdcyl's post
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#19
I’ve always thought that progress comes when a significant majority of the population support it (you may also say when politicians realise it matters to the electorate so legislate in favour!). To get to that tipping point you need awareness (amongst other things) and things like taking the knee is part of this.

I’ve nothing against sports people making political statements like this even if it’s a small action in the grand scheme of things. I can understand those who think politics doesn’t belong in sport but would concur that those who boo (or at least those that start it) are likely racist.
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#20
(03-06-2021, 04:58 PM)jdcyl Wrote: So, the political demonstrations around the globe for racial justice, and the particular form it takes in sports of ‘taking the knee’, are isolated within each country, huh?  They’re not all tied together as a global movement, it’s just coincidence that they’re happening in different countries at this time in history?

Is it not possible that something can evolve and become associated with something other than it's original meaning, or mean something else? 'Gay' has taken on a whole new meaning if you compare it's use 100 years ago. In the west, giving 'thumbs up' is viewed as a sign of approval, or good. In the middle east, it is the equivalent of a fuck you.

I am simply saying that some football fans might associate the action, taking the knee, with the far right political group who hijacked it here in the UK.
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