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Keir Starmer
what do we think?
#41
(12-05-2021, 06:10 PM)Tiuri Wrote:
(12-05-2021, 05:12 PM)cochineal Wrote: Had to register because grrr so much nonsense.

I do believe you're the first member ever to register for the discussion forums  Wink Welcome  Big Grin

Lol. Cheers very much.
[+] 1 user Likes cochineal's post
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#42
So, Starmer is now engaging in the sort of ruinous in-fighting that serves no purpose other than to try to prevent a radical Labour leader ever emerging again.

Labour conference: Sir Keir Starmer sets up conference battle over party reforms

If he put the same effort into fighting the Tories that he puts into fighting the left wing of his own party, he'd be faring a lot better in the polls. Instead, he's going down the route that many of us of a certain vintage will remember from the 1980s - the one that saw Kinnock lose consecutive elections.  Undecided
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#43
But if Kinnock hadn't done what he done, Labour would have stayed unelectable for another 20 years.

I'm torn on this.

I do think that unless he drags Labour back towards the centre more, they won't get elected. Its shockingly tragic.. but true.

On the other hand.. like you say, it just means more years of the 2 sides of Labour tearing each other apart.. so they won't get elected anyway.

Either way.. the Tories (spit) are here to stay.
[+] 1 user Likes ladsnet's post
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#44
The Tories are basically a centre left party now anyway. Looking at their policies they are more to the left than Blairs Labour.
Removing the incompetent Hancock, Willamson and Raab helps them too.
In terms of Starmer i had high hopes for him but he seems to have the personality of a dead fish and loves sitting on the fence on every issue. His front bench isnt that inspiring either, i doubt most of the public would have a clue who shadow chancellor, shadow home secretary etc were.
[+] 1 user Likes protaras's post
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#45
(25-09-2021, 03:31 PM)ladsnet Wrote: But if Kinnock hadn't done what he done, Labour would have stayed unelectable for another 20 years.

I'm torn on this.

I do think that unless he drags Labour back towards the centre more, they won't get elected. Its shockingly tragic.. but true.

On the other hand.. like you say, it just means more years of the 2 sides of Labour tearing each other apart.. so they won't get elected anyway.

Either way.. the Tories (spit) are here to stay.

But Kinnock wasn't electable - that's the point. He tried to be the acceptable face of Labour, but he ended up losing to John Major and next to nobody saw that coming.

There's a fallacy that Blair got elected by almost being right wing, but regardless of what he later turned into he was quite radical when he first got elected. Minimum wage, employment rights, devolution, freedom of information etc. He even said Labour shouldn't shy away from calling themselves socialist.

In contrast, Starmer is so beige he's in danger of blending into the scenery.

(25-09-2021, 04:57 PM)protaras Wrote: The Tories are basically a centre left party now anyway. 

Do people really think this? It's quite scary if so.
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#46
(25-09-2021, 08:24 PM)Ollie2UK Wrote:
(25-09-2021, 03:31 PM)ladsnet Wrote: But if Kinnock hadn't done what he done, Labour would have stayed unelectable for another 20 years.

I'm torn on this.

I do think that unless he drags Labour back towards the centre more, they won't get elected. Its shockingly tragic.. but true.

On the other hand.. like you say, it just means more years of the 2 sides of Labour tearing each other apart.. so they won't get elected anyway.

Either way.. the Tories (spit) are here to stay.

But Kinnock wasn't electable - that's the point. He tried to be the acceptable face of Labour, but he ended up losing to John Major and next to nobody saw that coming.

There's a fallacy that Blair got elected by almost being right wing, but regardless of what he later turned into he was quite radical when he first got elected. Minimum wage, employment rights, devolution, freedom of information etc. He even said Labour shouldn't shy away from calling themselves socialist.

In contrast, Starmer is so beige he's in danger of blending into the scenery.

(25-09-2021, 04:57 PM)protaras Wrote: The Tories are basically a centre left party now anyway. 

Do people really think this? It's quite scary if so.

When they got elected with a majority in December 2019 and filled their front bench with pro brexit ministers then I thought they would be right wing for sure.
However their policies have angered a lot of Daily Mail readers / Tory voters.  Furlough scheme continuing on for this long, the tax rise on National Insurance, their backbenchers were all very critical of vaccine passports etc.  On policy alone the Boris government has certainly not been right wing.
Even Priti Patel who I would describe as the most right wing of that front bench is constantly criticised by people like Farage for being a weak Home Secretary on immigration lol.
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#47
To be fair though... to your average Daily Mail reader, Hitler wasn't right wing enough.



Not looking like a good conference for Starmer.
Massive fall out with Rayner which means the left wing of the party despise him again, and now he's u-turning on his nationalisation pledges.

Another leadership battle soon ya think ? Although heaven knows who they'll pick next.
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#48
(26-09-2021, 01:16 PM)Ladsnet Wrote: Another leadership battle soon ya think ? Although heaven knows who they'll pick next.

I think they’ll be in opposition for at least the next two elections. Not saying that Boris will still be PM.
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#49
Sums it up really. The sooner there is a leadership battle, the better.

[Image: slcisQC.jpg]
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#50
Hmmmm...

He could have handed that in last week. But he decided to use it to torpedo the conference.

Not defending Starmer.. but Labours biggest enemy is itself at the moment. It's unelectable.
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#51
I'm definitely more social democrat than socialist and think that New Labour was on the whole, very good for the country. It wasn't perfect but a lot better than the last 11 years of underinvestment, culture waring and shit.  But it was 11 - 24 years ago and I think Labour really needs to move forward now. Starmer isn't Blair and this wasn't progressive enough.  
Maybe the elderly "red wallers" will lap this up but younger voters need some hope of brighter future too.
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#52
Apparently Rayner is furious with Andy MacDonald too.
She told him not to do it in the middle of conference as it just makes the party look like a laughing stock. He did it anyway.

Vote Labour.
LOL
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#53
It's all very depressing. I had high hopes for Starmer but it looks like we're comdemned to the Tories being in power for ever more......at least for the next 2 elections
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#54
(04-10-2021, 04:17 PM)the_scouser Wrote: It's all very depressing. I had high hopes for Starmer but it looks like we're comdemned to the Tories being in power for ever more......at least for the next 2 elections

After Corbyn, who was principalled but unelectable, I thought Starmer would do a good job. The pandemic hasn’t helped as its stifled his ability to get out there and be seen as a potential PM - who knows if it’s too late to turn things round (time will tell).

But watching the Blair-Brown documentary on BBC2 last night it feels like Labour are still in the position they were in the late 80’s/early 90’s i.e. slowly starting to come up with policies but not trusted enough by the electorate to be voted into government.

I always thought David Miliband or Andy Burnham would have been good leaders and likely elected as PM.
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#55
I’m quite liking Rayner calling out the Tories for what they are cunts scum. But yeah Keir is massive disappointed.
[+] 2 users Like Barry's post
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#56
I personally think he’s pretty much on a par with Boris for uselessness. But I’d gladly take care of his cock any time!
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#57
Glad there's someone on here who likes 50-somethings (he's almost 60). Big Grin
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#58
(21-10-2021, 03:23 AM)Parsifal Wrote: Glad there's someone on here who likes 50-somethings (he's almost 60). Big Grin

I definitely do, Kier always looks so great in his suits too and that sexy slightly flustered look he always has!
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